A Conspiracy of Kings Question

[drashizu.livejournal.com]

I'll put this behind a cut since it's pretty spoilerish.


Checkers suggested I post this question since it hasn't gotten a lot of discussion, so I will. Does anyone have any theories on why Eddis was so mad at Sophos at the end of ACoK? Judging by her reaction to his attempts to apologize, it wasn't because he had told her what not to do, and it wasn't because he had disappointed her. (Which, by the way, I'm also confused about. How does he think he's disappointed her?)

This scene is one of the most confusing ones of the entire book for me, so if you guys have any ideas, share them now! :)

Comments

[philia-fan.livejournal.com]

I haven't studied it in detail, but I had the impression that she wasn't really mad at him so much as she was mad at circumstances, at the fact that she really HAD to marry him and swear loyalty to Attolia, and maybe mad at herself that she hasn't told him everything.

[liereicarine.livejournal.com]

I wasn't sure also, but my best guesses were

1) Sophos had accused Gen of being greedy. Eddis who is very close to Gen knew exactly how much Gen didn't want to be a tool of the gods, didn't want to be a great king over the three countries or even the King of Attolia, how Gen had distanced hiself from Sophos because Gen didn't want Sophos to hand over Sounis's loyalty easily, and she thought Sophos should have had faith in Gen too. She was kinda disappointed in how blind Sophos was, in how little he trusted his friends.

2) Sophos said he couldn't allow Gen to be king over the three countries - meaning that he would not marry Eddis if that meant Gen got to be king. It was kinda like he would give up marrying Eddis if it meant he got to spoil Gen's 'devious greedy plans'. Basically he seemed not to want to marry Eddis or love her enough.

[liereicarine.livejournal.com]

Oh and in addition to 1), after reading philia_fan's comment about how Eddis was mad at circumstances... Perhaps the fact even Sophos thought Gen was being greedy made her think how the people of Eddis would hate Gen and villify him because of her decision to marry Sophos and cede Eddis to Attolia's sovereignty. Although she did that because of the dreams of the volcanos the gods had chosen to send her, not because Gen was exercising greedy influences over her. Perhaps that's why she brought Sophos to the library, so that he could understand her actions although she was mad in the fact that she couldn't change the minds of the people of Eddis once they found out, in the fact that it might have been a mistake to first send Gen to Attolia and now be a tool in making him suffer the kind of life he is as Annux.

Gen does think losing his hand and being king is worth it to marry Attolia though. :)

[drashizu.livejournal.com]

Ooh this is really delving deep into all the pressures put on the characters to make these decisions. Thank you, this makes a lot of sense now!

[freenarnian.livejournal.com]

I'm also of philia_fan's opinion. She was frustrated by circumstances, and the fact that she kind of HAS to marry Sophos in order to empty her people into his country before the mountain explodes. The potential for stress or mistrust in Sophos and Eddis' relationship is there because of this, and it's important that they convey their sincere affection for each other.

Also, because of Eddis' allegiance with Attolia, this brings some complicated three-way relations into the mix. Eugenides IS an Annux (a High King over Kings/Queens) at that point. Who can really blame them for having mixed feelings about this? =P

[(Anonymous)]

I have a COK's question

Okay when Eddis tells Magus to bring Sophos down to spar and Magus says why doesn't Attolis do it himself-and then stops himself because he knows why

WHY??

much thanks
velvetrose

[creative-lefty2.livejournal.com]

Funnily enough, my dad and I were reading this scene last night!

I believe that the Magus believes that Gen does not do it himself because it is all part of this stupid distancing act he has going on between himself and Sophos. The Magus is a fairly good acquaintance of Gen's and knows how he relies on image to inform people. Part of the image he is trying to portray when Sophos is there is also for the benefit of the Mede ambassador - I don't think Gen wants the Mede to see how close he and Sophos actually are. He just assumed that Sophos would understand this plan...and the Magus, who clearly took a while to catch on. Also, because it is Gen. That seems to be a good answer for much of what the King of Attolia does.

[checkers65477.livejournal.com]

That's what I thought, too. The magus knew Sophos and Gen had just met, and thought well, Gen could have asked Sophos himself. But, like you say, he's distancing himself and doesn't want Sophos to know what he has planned, so he summons Sophos through the Magus.

[(Anonymous)]

I have a COK's question

Okay when Eddis tells Magus to bring Sophos down to spar and Magus says why doesn't Attolis do it himself-and then stops himself because he knows why

WHY??

much thanks
velvetrose

[creative-lefty2.livejournal.com]

Well, to answer your second question, I believe that Sophos thinks he is a disappointment to Eddis because he has only started being successful at anything recently. He has always been the disappointment of the Sounis family (although not to us!) and is having a hard time adjusting to being a competent king and is still prone to overabundant amounts of self doubt.


As for your first question, part of it may be that Eddis is testing Sophos to see what he will do when faced with opposition. She knows that he can face off against his enemies, but she also wants to know that he can stand up for himself against those he loves. He did used to be a push over. I think part of it was also that she wanted him to say that he loved her for her and not for her country. Previous to this he had not told he that he dreamed of her every night. For all she knew his motivation to marry her now that he is king is because of the political connections it will give him.

Well, that's my two cents on this actually very complicated scene.

[drashizu.livejournal.com]

Thank you! I remember now, Sophos has that big moment of self-doubt with the wonderful beetle metaphor in it, right before he goes chasing after Eddis. And the idea that she's testing him is so... Genlike :)

[creative-lefty2.livejournal.com]

Well, she is Gen's cousin!

[(Anonymous)]

well, I admit that this scene confused me too (and also made me really uncomfortable, truth be told.. I hate it when perfectly rational characters up and freak out on me all of a sudden). But my best guess is that the circumstances just got too overwhelming: Eddis knows that she has to marry Sophos and they must give Sounis's and Eddis's loyalty to Gen and make him Annux, or everything is basically lost. She's probably spent way to much time already obsessing over the awful necessity of their plan, worrying about the effects on her people, and second-guessing herself the whole time. She knows Gen doesn't want any of this, and it tears her apart to have to go along with it, but she has finally managed to accept that it is really all for the best. So she's stretched to the breaking point mentally already, and then Sophos comes marching in, yelling about how greedy Gen is and how he will never let him take control of Eddis too, and how Sophos won't let Eddis do this, and it's really just the straw that breaks the camel's back. She loses her cool, which I guess is understandable given the circumstances and all that.

Just my (long and ramble-y) guess.

~toastisyummy

[harlyn.livejournal.com]

I basically agree with everyone else-- she was angry with their circumstances, and irritated with Sophos. She does forgive him pretty quickly. However, the discussion of how being Annux is going to make Gen *really* unhappy makes me wonder if this might be connected to the Gen-health-issues thing...maybe it's not to fool the Medes--maybe Gen is setting the stage for eventually faking his own death, after the political situation is sufficiently stablized? Being queen hasn't made Irene too happy either...maybe after they drive off the Medes they can 'die' and go live in a library?

[drashizu.livejournal.com]

They would love that! Seriously, they should live in a library. Too bad it can't be the Eddisian library since that's going to blow up soon... This reminds me of a fic (http://community.livejournal.com/queensthief_fic/22682.html) written in the queen'sthief_fic community recently.

[(Anonymous)]

This. You don't know how happy this suggestion has made me, even when half of my brain reasons that it wouldn't happen. Thanks.

Sommerrev

[finding-further.livejournal.com]

My 2 cents worth...

I basically agree with everyone above. I'd add that I think the scene was meant to highlight Sophos' character arc -- to show how much he has changed from the first pages of the book. Sophos is very strong here, and he's really come into his own as Sounis and as a young adult ("You cannot believe that I would allow that..." "It would be monstrous" blah, blah, blah) BUT he's also wiser that he was at the beginning, and has learned that when he makes an ass of himself, he needs to mend it straight away.

AND, as with the most of mwt's scenes, there are likely to be multiple layers of meaning. I think the scene is also meant to highlight the balance of power that the two must have in their relationship for the marriage to work, and so Eddis is frustrated with Sohpos when he fails to trust that she knows what she's doing. She's also probably frustrated that she has had to manipulate Sophos (not the best start for a marriage) and Sophos' stubborness is putting all of her careful planning in jeopardy.

[drashizu.livejournal.com]

This. Is a wonderful interpretation. Thank you!

[checkers65477.livejournal.com]

Everyone else pretty much said all this, but I think Eddis is angry because Sophos immediately assumes that Gen is greedy and Eddis is willing to give up her throne. Here they just went to all this trouble and worry to save him from a civil war, and he doesn't trust her (or Gen) enough to stop and think that there must be something going on he doesn't know about (the volcanic eruption). Then, to add insult to injury, he says, "no, I won't let you do that," as if he can tell her what to do or she needs to be told what to do.

Plus, like y'all said--she's aware that everyone else is going to assume those awful things about Gen and her, and Sophos seems willing to give her up just like that. She was disappointed in him and maybe also angry--and afraid--that all the stupid political stuff was going to keep her from marrying the man she loved--a marriage that would also help out a lot of people. She tried to tell him, then he stupidly spoke up about the marriage before they had talked about it, then he wouldn't listen to her try to explain.

The first time I read it I thought Eddis overreacted, but I think toastisyummy put it very well. Straw that broke the camel's back.

[finding-further.livejournal.com]

Ooooooo... pretty picture. I want to go there.</>

[checkers65477.livejournal.com]

It's Cancun!

[katecoombs.livejournal.com]

I'm with Checkers. Mostly, I think Sophos starts bossing Eddis around about the situation without asking her what she really thinks and making a plan as a couple. On top of that, how much does he care if he's ready to drop her so fast for political reasons? Where's the respect, let alone the devotion? Ironically, he thinks he's being a knight in shining armor for her, but she's not interested in being a damsel in distress. She's more like, "He-LO! Wake up and smell the conspiracy, Sophos!"

[drashizu.livejournal.com]

Heehee:) Nice link-back to the title of the book!

[skatingreader.livejournal.com]

May a reader who has lots of time and a scholarly approach make an observation?

Re-reading it very carefully ... Eddis has said that there are things Sophos needs to know with regard to marrying p. 296 (top) "There is no reason I would not be honored to join Eddis to you. But it is complicated by many things that I must tell you about first." Then Sophos seems to stop thinking and he doesn't let her tell him about what is so important to her that she has not said yes. She even says " and some of it important. I would ask ..."

She has not said yes and he has not listened. And then he lets the magus and Xanthe think that everything is set.

"Eddis felt the blood rising in her face." Is she embarrassed ... or angry that he is acting as if she has said yes, when she has clearly said that there are things to discuss first. Or is she upset that things are going to get even more complicated because he doesn't have the whole story?

Then to make matters worse he tells Gen that they are to marry ... when it has not been agreed at all.

"Attolia looked sharply at Eddis, who shook her head." Whatever has not been discussed by Eddis and Sounis would probably have made such a public announcement inappropriate at that time.

page 300 "she had not considered that the ceremony would slip from its careful scripting"

Eddis is angry/upset because Sounis has messed things up because he has not listened to her carefully.

Notice what Gen says to Sounis thinking that he is Eddis ... "Have you convinced him?" Convinced him of what?

MWT goes on to tell us that Sounis and Eddis have spent the day in the library without any attendants ... and Gen asks Sounis "Has she convinced you?" But we don't know ... convinced him of what?

It seems to me that more was said in the library than we know ... we have only read a few lines of dialogue from those hours of discussion. I expect that we have another whole book to read which may very well deal with the complications about which we have only had hints.

MWT is the tricky one ... Gen is the character she created ... he's not any trickier and given to hiding things in plain sight than she is.

These books demand that I be careful and patient as a reader. I have given up assuming that I will "get" these books on any fewer than six or seven readings. I value discussions such as these to force me back to the text to dig out what is really there. That is one of things I love about MWT. She makes me slow down and go back to see what she really wrote, not what I think she wrote.

[checkers65477.livejournal.com]

Great comments!

"Eddis felt the blood rising in her face." Is she embarrassed ... or angry that he is acting as if she has said yes, when she has clearly said that there are things to discuss first. Or is she upset that things are going to get even more complicated because he doesn't have the whole story?

I thought--both. She's thinking he's an idiot for not listening when she was trying to tell him vital things he needs to know before they seriously discuss a marriage, and upset that she now has to tell him that she *does* want to marry him but, hey there are other things going on here, too.

Convince him that she wasn't giving up her country for him--she's actually sacrificing her sovereignty for the people of Eddis, but she's willing to do that. Not just for love, but for her people. AND convince him that Eddis and Gen saved Sounis (the country) with a plan that saved Eddis (the country) as well. Doesn't it say at the end of the book that Sophos probably could have saved Sounis without pledging himself to Attolis? But they didn't give him that option because of their plan to save the people of Sounis.

I also stand by my assumption that there was some making-out going on in the library, too.

[drashizu.livejournal.com]

:D Of course, I love that MWT gives her characters the privacy that she does. But it can't stop us from speculating wildly!