What is Eddis not revealing in Conspiracy of Kings?

[11rod88staff11.livejournal.com]

After reading the book once all the way through and going back for infinite, infinite rereads of my favorite parts and many rereads of the detail in between, I think I understand that she has not revealed that she has already reached an agreement with the Attolias to cede her country to Gen... because of the prophetic dream about the volcano eruption that would destroy any possibility of the Eddisian people continuing their lives as they know it... but I'm not totally clear at exactly what Helen is withholding from Sophos... and exactly why she withholds it.

Can anyone offer me some clarity on this?

Comments

[freenarnian.livejournal.com]

I feel like I start this puzzle over every time I re-read ACoK, but I think it comes together as Helen NEEDING to merge her country with Sounis (under Sophos) in order to evacuate the Eddisians before LAVA. Of course, that's dependent on Sophos winning his country back from the rebels and Medes first, and then there's the issue of Sophos pledging himself to Attolia (under Gen). So I think, as far as loyalties and allegiances are concerned, it works out to something like Eddis>Sounis>Attolia, in which case Gen IS becoming a "king of kings" (or High King of sorts) as predicted at the end of KoA.

(And boy is Helen gonna have to explain that one to her people.)

Why did she keep this from Sophos? Personal reasons might've played a part, as she genuinely loved Sophos, but as a Queen she had to put her people first (say, in the event that Sophos failed to take back Sounis)... She might have needed to form a different alliance (with Attolia?) in that event.

Others, please chime in if I'm missing any relevant points!

[(Anonymous)]

I think the other factor is related to time. Volcanoes erupt with little warning unless you know what you're looking for (scentless hydrogen sulphide, for example) and Eddis has already been giving a divine warning that it will happen. But she doesn't know exactly when, except she will be the last ruling Eddis.

Though personally not at all thrilled, Eddis accepts the necessity of Gen marrying Attolia (in the larger scheme of things) and the political advantages will allow the Eddisians when the disaster occurs (mostly moving people south). But it's not enough - she knows she needs Sounis too (because the Attolians will resent a huge influx of refugees from an entire country) and she didn't like the terms that the previous king (Sophos' uncle) had in mind (he probably wanted to take over the mountains and move more people there or keep the Eddisians there).

By the time Sophos inherits the Sounisian throne, I get the feeling that while Eddis and Gen feel guilty on a personal level for forces the new king of Sounis (who as we've seen lacks a great deal of the political savvy that Eddis, Attolia, and Gen have displayed throughout the first three books) into a political position that benefits their own first.

And if they waited to let Sophos develop the confidence to become a king who could take by Sounis without the support of Attolis, it might have been too late to save Eddis.

[manderelee.livejournal.com]

From my recent reread, it appears to me that what she really held back is the fact that she and Gen made Sophos believe that he couldn't have taken his country back without violence.

But Sophos had to know that she and Eugenides had let him ride away with an Attolian army at his back, believing he needed it. With more faith in himself, and his father's army, he could have retaken his throne without Attolia's aid. He might not have followed that bloodier and costly path, but Eddis and Attolis hadn't offered him the choice.

"Yes," Eddis admitted, praying that he would not ask for an apology she could not give."

She needed him to believe that he had to be someone he was not, someone who resorted to violence.

[freenarnian.livejournal.com]

Interesting point... *ponders*

Do you think he could have? Taken his country back without any violence, that is. I got the impression that, by the end, Sophos had tried every other option (and still the violence didn't sit well with him--hence the weeping over Gen's gift and the realization that if he couldn't be Eddis, he'd have to be Attolia).

I know part of Gen's inner angst and outward coldness was over the fact that, by helping Sophos, he was essentially helping himself (to the country of Sounis), and that made him feel kind of crummy, but Sophos acknowledged from the get-go that he needed and wanted the help of his friend the King of Attolia, yes? He needed Gen's military power and cunning and was willing to make some compromises in order to secure what would be a desirable (and necessary, when the Medes show up) alliance.

[beth-shulman.livejournal.com]

There's a loooot of ambiguity around that in ACoK, and I've never been able to decide if I like that or not. I think ultimately MWT writes that Sophos and Gen came to the same conclusion - that Attolia's help would be necessary here - but also that, looking back, Gen essentially made the decision for him and didn't allow Sophos to explore any other options. Meaning it would have been the same decision regardless - but Sophos didn't make it on his own.

[atticadayz.livejournal.com]

Your comment made me realize that the other options could have been as secretly political as how Gen usually operates. Some plot or another, some twisting of people's secrets, Etc. Instead all Sophos did was try to talk to his barons and convince them in the matter of a few days. Gen certainly could have helped creat an intricate plot that wouldn't have ended in bloodshed.

[agh-4.livejournal.com]

I agree with both of the comments above -- I also got the impression that, regarding the alliance, Eddis hasn't necessarily reached an official agreement with Gen (and Irene, I'm sure) as much they both have an understanding (since QoA) that the people of Eddis need somewhere to go before the sacred mountain erupts, and that the Eddis-Sounis marriage is the easiest way to secure that future. Eddis also recognizes the need for a united peninsula against the Medes, so therefore the Annux-over-Sounis situation is something she would probably support even if the stakes weren't so high for her own country.

Before Sophos returns from Elisa, she withholds it because he hasn't won back his own country yet. Maybe she and Gen thought it would be too much to entrust him with in case he failed, or that it would be too much pressure for him to know just how much hung in the balance (something else they might not be able to apologize for, see Leng's comment). After he returns, she INTENDS to tell him as soon as they get engaged ("it is complicated by many things that I must tell you about first"), but he's too pleased to let her speak and then messes it all up by mentioning it in the ceremony.

Also -- the gods and the visions they bring, especially this one, are hard to talk about. I'm sure that's part of why she doesn't tell him in the first half of the book, as well.

[checkers65477.livejournal.com]

I think, too, that Helen, Irene, and Gen had already decided they would wrestle Sounis away from its king. The plan was made back when Sophos's uncle was Sounis, and that's why Gen apologizes to Sophos at the beginning of ACoK, when he learns that Sophos is now Sounis. Helen hid from Sophos the plan to take Sounis one way or another and the fact that the volcano made this necessary. Then, she and Gen did nothing to convince him that he could become the ruling king under his own right, without Eddis or Attolia's help. They manipulated him and kept things from him, including the fact that there was a library in Attolia that looked just like the one in his dreams.

[beth-shulman.livejournal.com]

Didn't see this before I commented, but it's a much more cogent version of what I think!

[freenarnian.livejournal.com]

Ah, that does make sense and brings a lot of clarity to the issue. Thanks!

(And poor Sophos. Did they not think he'd be sympathetic if they just told him the whole truth from the get-go? I suppose politics and emotions WILL be complicated, no matter what. And it'd been a long time since anyone had seen or heard from him, in order to judge whether he'd truly make a strong king or not. At least he had the Magus in his corner. Yay Magus!)

The Secrets Revealed... and more

[11rod88staff11.livejournal.com]

All of the responses here helped incredibly much, thank you so much everyone. I understand from a much deeper level now exactly what went on. Although, the book, is titled "Conspiracy of Kings" which I take to mean the kings, Eugenides and Sophos. But from what we are discussing right now it seems like the "Conspiracy" is more primarily between Eugenides, Irene and Helen..who keep Sophos in the dark around the true extent of his sovereign potential and power. Is there an ultimate conspiracy exclusively between Gen and Sophos that I am missing?

and it's like... Sophos is in a way being "left in the dark" from how we see that Eddis is keeping something from him:

"There is a great deal I don't know," he said seriously. "And not just about the gods."

"Looking into his unsmiling face, Eddis knew it was as close as he would ever come to an accusation. (CoK p. 310)

And from what I understand you are all thinking, Attolia, Attolis, and Eddis needed Sophos to believe that he needed their help to retake his country, and he is driven to do it by means of threat and violence, which ultimately felt like less empowering, desperate measures to him, which set him up to feel he is in a place of dependence and submission to the other monarchs and mostly to Attolis.... which set grounds for the sovereign hierarchy in which Sophos is not only beneath Attolis in vow, promise, and treaty, but also placed squarely within emotional boundaries for what he believes is possible for himself-- they set limits on the faith he has in himself.

But then what does this mean? (continues further on p. 310)
"He [Sophos] had been saved by the men Eugenides sent, though he did not yet know the ferocity with which the king of Attolia had stripped those men from other posts, the capital he had expended, the secrets that had been revealed in order to send help to Sounis."

Why was it this tremendous sacrifice to send an army when from what I understand Attolia's army is quite large? (or is that just her palace guard?) Why did they need to salvage men from posts outside their military? It sounds like they straight up drafted an army from a pool of civilians. And what SECRETS were revealed?????

p. 310 continues....
"But Sophos had to know that she [Helen] and Eugenides had let him ride away with an Attolian army at his back, believing he needed it. With more faith in himself, and his father's army, he could have retaken his throne without Attolia's aid. He might not have followed that bloodier and more costly path, but Eddis and Attolis hadn't offered him the choice."

I think much about how Irene's own experiences being driven to violent, desperate means by the patriarchy-- how it broke her heart and damaged her as a person. "If I couldn't be Eddis, I could be Attolia" Sophos says, at some point. Sophos understands the hierarchy of energetic vibration of his two choices. With how Eugenides, Helen, and Irene intentionally keep him in lower energies, "break him in" a little bit by creating a false sense of desperate measures for him... is that MWT's direct way of establishing a connection between him and Irene? What's in common between them? As Irene continues to soften, Sophos continues to harden.

Re: The Secrets Revealed... and more

[celebrilomiel.livejournal.com]

But then what does this mean? (continues further on p. 310)
"He [Sophos] had been saved by the men Eugenides sent, though he did not yet know the ferocity with which the king of Attolia had stripped those men from other posts, the capital he had expended, the secrets that had been revealed in order to send help to Sounis."

Why was it this tremendous sacrifice to send an army when from what I understand Attolia's army is quite large? (or is that just her palace guard?) Why did they need to salvage men from posts outside their military? It sounds like they straight up drafted an army from a pool of civilians. And what SECRETS were revealed?????

Attolia had been at war with Eddis and Sounis in QoA, and was still heavily on guard against the Mede invasion. I always took that passage to mean that Eugenides took existing soldiers from their assigned posts around Attolia — where they were guarding the coastline, the passages, the citadels, protecting the country — and mobilized them as a special task force to go to Sophos's aid. It takes a lot of money to outfit, provision, and deploy troops, so Gen was sacrificing both Attolia's treasury and Attolia's defense. If the Mede had decided to strike Attolia while such a large portion of their troops were in Sounis, Attolia would have fallen easily.

Sophos weeps when he receives Gen's gift...

[11rod88staff11.livejournal.com]

Sophos "weeps" ... very long and fully, it seems like, when it is revealed through the revolver gifts that both Attolia and Attolis are counseling violence. Is this scene meant to really emphasize just how much Sophos resists this? To illustrate his surrender? And, surrender to how many different things?

And what is the significance of how Gen requested that Sophos wait to open his gift/confirmation of Attolia's message? Gen says something like "wait to open my gift until you have thought as much as you can about what you believe is best." Gen says this even though apparently, he, Irene and Helen never really intended him to think and make his own choices of his own free will.

So... is it out of their own fear or lack of faith in Sophos that the three older monarchs don't believe Sophos is able to develop the confidence "in time" ? I suppose it is for the best, that doing what they can to get Sophos under their authority for the greater good / sparing the least time to take action immigrating the Eddisians before the eruption... Is it purely for time and efficiency's sake that they would pull the wool over their friend's eyes?