A Prying Question
Dec. 1st, 2010 08:15 pm![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
mortalasabee.livejournal.com posting in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png){kind=small}
queensthiefI work on a farm, and recently I was looking around the shop for a pry bar to tear apart an old chicken coop.
I'm sure you know exactly where my mind went, and if yours doesn't go to the same place I will be greatly disappointed in you.
When I finally found it (it was cleverly hidden right in front of me) I picked it up, and it was a comfort to have it in my hand, even though I was sure there was nothing living in the chicken coop. I was smiling at my geeky self when a sudden question hit me:
Why on earth was Pol carrying a pry bar?
Naturally, this question distracted me for the rest of the day, and I speculated and formulated theories all the time I was ripping into the coop. As soon as work was done I called my best friend (you may remember him from this story of his birthday) and we speculated and formulated theories together.
Here's what we came up with.
Pol is a soldier. He is therefore used to traveling prepared. But why would a soldier need a pry bar? Certainly not for protection, as I'm sure he is more adept with a sword, and with Gen along he probably wasn't planning on breaking in anywhere himself. Was he carrying it for Gen to use? This would make sense; the Magus probably guessed that Gen would need one. However, it seems odd that Pol would carry an awkward, heavy tool up and down a mountain on the off chance that Gen would ask for one. It made us wonder what else he was carrying just in case Gen wanted it. Wouldn't it have made sense, if you are going to haul a tool across three countries, that you would ask Gen, the well-behaved tool, what tools he would need?
Now for some photos.
The modern pry bar I was using looked like this.
We could see how a tool like this could be useful to Gen. It could be used for propping open windows or doors and finding the treasure box hidden in the bedframe. While we still could not see why Pol would happen to have such a tool, we did think that it was small enough and light enough to be plausible. However, there are some objections to this tool: first, it is not very big, and I don't think you could break a big piece of obsidian with it, even though the tool Gen had was probably iron and a lot heavier than the modern ones. And if it was heavy enough, why would Pol be carting such a heavy tool around? Second, it is very flat, and would be hard to trip over.
Here is another, larger, heavier pry bar, (looks like a crowbar but the website I found it on sells it as a pry bar, which I guess means nothing in the QT world but, well, there's no wiki article on ancient Greek pry bars,) which looks similar to the one on the cover of this edition of TT.
I think this is more likely what Gen was using. It looks like it could easily be used to break the obsidian window, and is of great enough girth to be painfully tripped over. But, even more than the last one, I cannot believe that Pol would have carried this the whole way. I have used a crowbar before and they are really freakin heavy, and the one Gen used was probably iron, and one this size would be
Another theory, which we both dismissed as preposterous, is that Gen needed something to break the glass with, and so mwt gave Pol a pry bar. Convenient pry bar is convenient. I simply cannot believe this to be true. I trust our author too much.
So I know that there must be some logical reason. What do you all think? Does our "Pol wouldn't carry such a clumsy tool without being sure it would needed" theory hold water? Can you think of any reason why Pol had one? Help!
PS Later, after he drops the pry bar and the lamp in the trap, he says " I didn't want to waste the time it would take to go back out to the magus to get another lamp and a pry bar..." What does he think Pol is, the source of neverending pry bars?
PPS I hope no one laughs at me for obsessing over a pry bar.
I'm sure you know exactly where my mind went, and if yours doesn't go to the same place I will be greatly disappointed in you.
When I finally found it (it was cleverly hidden right in front of me) I picked it up, and it was a comfort to have it in my hand, even though I was sure there was nothing living in the chicken coop. I was smiling at my geeky self when a sudden question hit me:
Why on earth was Pol carrying a pry bar?
Naturally, this question distracted me for the rest of the day, and I speculated and formulated theories all the time I was ripping into the coop. As soon as work was done I called my best friend (you may remember him from this story of his birthday) and we speculated and formulated theories together.
Here's what we came up with.
Pol is a soldier. He is therefore used to traveling prepared. But why would a soldier need a pry bar? Certainly not for protection, as I'm sure he is more adept with a sword, and with Gen along he probably wasn't planning on breaking in anywhere himself. Was he carrying it for Gen to use? This would make sense; the Magus probably guessed that Gen would need one. However, it seems odd that Pol would carry an awkward, heavy tool up and down a mountain on the off chance that Gen would ask for one. It made us wonder what else he was carrying just in case Gen wanted it. Wouldn't it have made sense, if you are going to haul a tool across three countries, that you would ask Gen, the well-behaved tool, what tools he would need?
Now for some photos.
The modern pry bar I was using looked like this.
We could see how a tool like this could be useful to Gen. It could be used for propping open windows or doors and finding the treasure box hidden in the bedframe. While we still could not see why Pol would happen to have such a tool, we did think that it was small enough and light enough to be plausible. However, there are some objections to this tool: first, it is not very big, and I don't think you could break a big piece of obsidian with it, even though the tool Gen had was probably iron and a lot heavier than the modern ones. And if it was heavy enough, why would Pol be carting such a heavy tool around? Second, it is very flat, and would be hard to trip over.
Here is another, larger, heavier pry bar, (looks like a crowbar but the website I found it on sells it as a pry bar, which I guess means nothing in the QT world but, well, there's no wiki article on ancient Greek pry bars,) which looks similar to the one on the cover of this edition of TT.
I think this is more likely what Gen was using. It looks like it could easily be used to break the obsidian window, and is of great enough girth to be painfully tripped over. But, even more than the last one, I cannot believe that Pol would have carried this the whole way. I have used a crowbar before and they are really freakin heavy, and the one Gen used was probably iron, and one this size would be
Another theory, which we both dismissed as preposterous, is that Gen needed something to break the glass with, and so mwt gave Pol a pry bar. Convenient pry bar is convenient. I simply cannot believe this to be true. I trust our author too much.
So I know that there must be some logical reason. What do you all think? Does our "Pol wouldn't carry such a clumsy tool without being sure it would needed" theory hold water? Can you think of any reason why Pol had one? Help!
PS Later, after he drops the pry bar and the lamp in the trap, he says " I didn't want to waste the time it would take to go back out to the magus to get another lamp and a pry bar..." What does he think Pol is, the source of neverending pry bars?
PPS I hope no one laughs at me for obsessing over a pry bar.
no subject
Date: 12/2/10 03:21 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 03:33 am (UTC)*narrows eyes and glares around*
Now, unfortunately, I have no real insight into this question, other than that the extremely buff Pol can certainly handle a measly little ol' pry-bar on an ickle walk. I think you're not giving him enough credit, here. He has to stay in shape somehow; that's probably what he used to lift weights before hitting the sack.
no subject
Date: 12/2/10 04:26 am (UTC)I don't doubt that Pol COULD carry it, I just wonder WHY he would do it without a very good reason.
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Date: 12/3/10 02:43 am (UTC)I think we obsessed over what people called pry-bars before. Pry-bars vs. pry bars vs. crowbars. I've always called them crowbars, m'self. I think we determined it was a regional thing.
no subject
Date: 12/3/10 04:22 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/4/10 05:04 pm (UTC)My expectation for a pseudo-Byzantine pry bar would be that it was a relatively short (1-1.5 ft since they're carrying it with them) piece of circular or square rod with a flattened end to wedge between things. They wouldn't be pulling nails, so there's no need for a claw on the end. That would be heavy enough to chip away at rock if you used the flattened end.
-riv
no subject
Date: 12/2/10 04:45 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 03:39 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 04:23 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 04:33 am (UTC)Hheh. This post is wonderful.
I definitely buy that he'd be taking it along as a tool for Gen. The Magus supplies him with other tools, so it makes sense. As for being heavy and inexact for Pol to carry around, I don't think he'd dismiss a tool just because of that.
:/
no subject
Date: 12/2/10 04:33 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 04:37 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 04:43 am (UTC)Pol also lugged around two wooden practice swords (They were in his pack, while the boys carried their real ones.) so it's not that crazy for him to have lugged a pry-bar as well with less-than-huge reason. The magus brought Gen's tools on purpose, so them bringing other things it seemed like a thief might need wouldn't be surprising. And as for balancing size and usefulness, probably it was smallish like your first picture, but of a heavy metal, and the sharpish part made the cracks in the obsidian.
Still, I would say even great authors can have accidental moments of "convenient prybar is convenient." It's just a prybar.
Or, you know, maybe Pol was afraid he'd get out of shape on this jaunt, so he loaded up his pack with utterly random lead tools just to add weight and keep his muscles working.
no subject
Date: 12/2/10 04:47 am (UTC)Though I think the first one is plausible. Good point about the practice swords too. I guess if he was willing to lug those around he would say "what magus? You want me to haul a pry bar up the mountain just for kicks? Why, of course magus."
no subject
Date: 12/2/10 05:00 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 04:57 am (UTC)I've wondered this too, and my only running theory is that Pol is a boyscout. A prybar is a heavy but certainly useful tool in a number of circumstances. Who knows? Sophos could've slipped and gotten wedged under a tree, and Pol made sure he would have his nifty prybar to drag him back out again. Okay... So maybe Sophos being accident prone is not the best explanation, but hey... it appeals to me.
Either way, Pol may have theorized that certain tools were likely to be needed. If not specifically by Gen, perhaps by the rest of the party. It's like camping. When you are stranded out in the middle of no-wheres-vil those extra flashlight batteries may be heavy, but you probably still want to bring them along just in case. Better safe than sorry?
What does he think Pol is, the source of neverending pry bars?
Dah! You gave me an image of Pol with MaryP's bag. How evil of you. Err... This is still the first night, right? Gen assumes the Gift is nearby, and he wants to just slip in and grab it. Also, he's not certain how much times he has before the water returns, and it may simply be he has little desire to re-journey back into a potential death trap for a curvy piece of iron. No matter how useful it may be.
PS: Do you work on a dairy farm in WIsconsin? Kudos to you! I live right near several hay farms. We even have sheep farms further north. Have you noticed?
no subject
Date: 12/2/10 05:17 am (UTC)So far in this post we have Pol!Jeeves, Pol!Boyscout, and Pol!Mary Poppins.
But the "be prepared" theory is good. I suppose if it was small it would just be a useful tool to have around. Heavy but useful.
rePS: It's an organic vegetable CSA, but I also worked one day a week with a neighboring organic dairy farmer. (My internship actually finished recently, but I was still working there when this all happened so I pretended for dramatic purposes that I was still working there.) Sheep! I'm going to have sheep one day. Are you up North in WI?
no subject
Date: 12/2/10 05:57 am (UTC)re-PS: Central, but I visit Superior's south shore every now and then. Organic! More kudos.
Oh yeah, and because I'm dropping this link to anyone I think will care... Do you want to see Gen on a cop show? Well, that's pretty much what this show is. I've hooked about 10 members on Chatzy already. And I mean hooked. I'm very proud.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8y8fJm5kNY
no subject
Date: 12/3/10 03:19 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/3/10 02:40 am (UTC)Excuse me, if I walk out into my garage, I can put my hands on one of those right now. They're not that old-fashioned!
no subject
Date: 12/2/10 05:48 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 07:43 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/3/10 06:55 pm (UTC)However, for plausibility's sake, it's easy to carry eggs safely - store them in flour or something like that. Say, ground coffee =]
no subject
Date: 12/3/10 09:43 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/5/10 09:06 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/5/10 08:43 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/5/10 09:11 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 09:44 am (UTC):P
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Date: 12/2/10 10:59 am (UTC)Magus: Okay, so we have provisions, we'll stop here, here, and here, what tools will the thief likely need? We have the tools he had with him, is that it? What he had on him was small and easy to conceal.
Pol: He might also need some rope and a pry bar of some sort.
Magus: Can you fit those in your packs along with the practice swords? If we pack too much we'll need to bring a cart.
no subject
Date: 12/2/10 04:06 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 04:41 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 06:01 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 10:18 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/2/10 10:50 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/3/10 12:24 am (UTC)Never really thought about it. I just assumed that when the Magus mentioned that the thief-kit he brought along was Gen's from the start, the pry bar came with it, but in retrospect that idea seems silly. How would Gen jump across lightwells with a heavy iron stick in tow? Still, I'll never believe in the convenient pry bar from above. I believe in you MWT!
no subject
Date: 12/3/10 05:05 pm (UTC)Mortalasabee, what a wonderful question!
And I have the perfect answer! (Pats self on back, as my cat isn't doing that just now).
Is our wonderful Pol an endless source of prybars? Alas, no!
But the Magus is, well, not an infinite source, but yet a pretty reliable source of MONEY!
And remember, these two went shopping, just before our heroes set out across the dystopia. And thanks to Gen's amazingly clever narrative, we do not learn the contents of their shopping baskets.
So.....is there any village too small to contain a pry bar? Or could they have bought one?
To me, a greater mystery is ...how did Pol get those eggs across the dystopia without smashing them? Especially if he also had a pry bar in his pocket ;-)
PS I'm glad to learn that a pry bar is actually a crow bar -- and I'm glad it's not a gandy dancer! Now those are very useful, but LARGE!
no subject
Date: 12/3/10 09:42 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 12/4/10 05:57 am (UTC)tl;dr orz
Date: 12/6/10 02:00 am (UTC)The magus wanted to give Gen all the tools of his trade, right? I imagine a thief would have to pry their way through locked chests and drawers and suchlike. And the magus knew they would be going into an underwater temple place - might there not be doors rusted shut? Or really heavy stone doors that need to be pried open.
Does that make sense?