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queensthiefok, here are my questions from KoA - yay, i'm so excited, because this is my favourite book in the series for the moment (it keeps changing).
1. in the first part, attolia isnt very nice to gen (e.g, "You would have come, too? Following like the tail behind the dog?", "Unkingly, in so many ways , My King.", saying he had no sense of dignity, etc).
i first read KoA years after i'd read QoA, and i didnt have QoA with me right then, so i couldnt check anything. i remembered they got married at the end, and that they were possibly in love, but i kept thinking, why is she so mean to him, and that her behaviour totally encouraged the guards and his attendants to think that he was stupid and inept, and to play pranks on him, be rude to his face, etc. so what was up with that? i think i read previous posts where someone suggested they were flirting, but really? was he in on it and enjoying the whole thing (because it was painful to watch it even when i knew she loved him)? or was it that they had decided to show him as stupid and not fit to be a king because that was part of his plan, and she was acting along with him?
2. when eugenides goes to attolia's room after leaving costis, he says "Do you still wish you'd hanged me?" and her answer is "Men's necks have been broken by a single blow". i didnt get that at all. please explain? (i obviously need things spelled out for me).
3. and right after that, it says, "It was vain to hope that he might cease to have things to apologize for". why would he have to keep apologizing?
4. in the part where attolia offers gen her wine cup in front of the entire court, "The people sitting nearby recoiled", and then the wine boy lunges forward to fill eugenides's wine cup so hastily that he spills some on the table cloth. why would they recoil, would they care if he was poisoned in front of their eyes? i thought no one wanted him there and wouldnt give a damn if he was murdered.
5. when they are dancing after that, the conversation goes:
"Why were these the only dances that you knew?"
"Because no one would dance with me. Thieves are never popular".
I know why, thought Attolia, but aloud she said... well, something else.
what did she know why? why those were the only dances he knew? why no one would dance with him? why thieves are never popular? whats the point behind those lines?
6. when eugenides confronts dite, why doesnt dite want to hear more about the king's wedding night? why does he recoil and why was he shaking?
7. why did baron susa think costis had revealed something "very important indeed" when he said eugenides spent his time alone staring out the window?
1. in the first part, attolia isnt very nice to gen (e.g, "You would have come, too? Following like the tail behind the dog?", "Unkingly, in so many ways , My King.", saying he had no sense of dignity, etc).
i first read KoA years after i'd read QoA, and i didnt have QoA with me right then, so i couldnt check anything. i remembered they got married at the end, and that they were possibly in love, but i kept thinking, why is she so mean to him, and that her behaviour totally encouraged the guards and his attendants to think that he was stupid and inept, and to play pranks on him, be rude to his face, etc. so what was up with that? i think i read previous posts where someone suggested they were flirting, but really? was he in on it and enjoying the whole thing (because it was painful to watch it even when i knew she loved him)? or was it that they had decided to show him as stupid and not fit to be a king because that was part of his plan, and she was acting along with him?
2. when eugenides goes to attolia's room after leaving costis, he says "Do you still wish you'd hanged me?" and her answer is "Men's necks have been broken by a single blow". i didnt get that at all. please explain? (i obviously need things spelled out for me).
3. and right after that, it says, "It was vain to hope that he might cease to have things to apologize for". why would he have to keep apologizing?
4. in the part where attolia offers gen her wine cup in front of the entire court, "The people sitting nearby recoiled", and then the wine boy lunges forward to fill eugenides's wine cup so hastily that he spills some on the table cloth. why would they recoil, would they care if he was poisoned in front of their eyes? i thought no one wanted him there and wouldnt give a damn if he was murdered.
5. when they are dancing after that, the conversation goes:
"Why were these the only dances that you knew?"
"Because no one would dance with me. Thieves are never popular".
I know why, thought Attolia, but aloud she said... well, something else.
what did she know why? why those were the only dances he knew? why no one would dance with him? why thieves are never popular? whats the point behind those lines?
6. when eugenides confronts dite, why doesnt dite want to hear more about the king's wedding night? why does he recoil and why was he shaking?
7. why did baron susa think costis had revealed something "very important indeed" when he said eugenides spent his time alone staring out the window?
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 01:13 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 4/26/11 03:08 pm (UTC)(2) She's talking about Costis hitting him. She has guessed that Gen was provoking the guards and is upset that he is risking his safety.
(3) Because HE IS GEN! And is likely to keep on putting himself at risk and stirring the waters like a hurricane with an attitude.
(4) Because they were a little shocked. Even if you don't like someone, you don't exactly want to be privy to that person being poisoned in front of you. I mean, think about it... You're at dinner with your in-laws (is assuming you don't like your in-laws) and someone goes, "hey, I may have poisoned that wine you were drinking just now." How would you probably react? Also this - http://sounis.livejournal.com/425567.html?thread=10605663#t10605663
(5) The Thieves are a group that the Eddisians are just a little bit wary of. But either way... I mostly think Irene is expressing her irritation with Gen in this scene, as he is messing with her just a little by making her dance with him in front of her court.
(6) Because Dite is in love with Irene. I know if I were head-over-heels in love with someone, I wouldn't want to hear about what they got up to during their honeymoon. XD
(7) This one is subtle, but as far as I can tell, Susa thinks Gen becoming more introverted and possibly being homesick is important news. He may think it's a weakness in the king that he can exploit. Knowing what someone cares about is often the key to easily manipulating them.
Yay, I got through them all!
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 03:20 pm (UTC)Irene snarking at Gen doesn't exactly imply that she thinks he is an idiot. That fact that he can verbally spare with someone like her is actually a tribute to his strength, but Irene's court, knowing what she is like, thinks he's stupid for challenging her, as Costis notes later. And also... Irene is used to taking charge. As a female-leader, she can't let any weakness show. She's still trying to dominate the situation with her authoritative behavior. But mostly, I think she is upset with him for provoking the guards and getting into trouble.
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 04:10 pm (UTC)#6 -- Gen just told Dite that Attolia cried on her wedding night. Even more reason he wouldn't want to hear more.
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 05:44 pm (UTC)HA!
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 05:54 pm (UTC)#5 I always thought it was sort of a response to his whole comment there: "Because no one would dance with me. Thieves are never popular."
The ladies of the court in Eddis, not only being wary because he is THE THIEF, but also knowing they are going to be missing accessories if they dance with him, would not want to do it. As he so wonderfully demonstrates in the following scene, dancing gives him plenty of opportunity for removing the belongings of his partner.
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 06:17 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 4/26/11 06:45 pm (UTC)if the king died in the frist few months of his rein there would be war and attolia would not survive another war.
or something like that.
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 06:48 pm (UTC)Also, she must have known that Costis, the steady guard from whatever battle it was, had to have been sorely provoked to punch Gen. He's stirred up all kinds of trouble, he could have broken his stupid neck, and now she might have to execute one of her loyal guards. She's angry at Gen, too.
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 06:54 pm (UTC)thats the perfect explanation!! yup, thats totally why no one would dance with him!!
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 06:59 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 4/26/11 07:00 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 4/26/11 07:03 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 4/26/11 08:18 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 4/26/11 08:23 pm (UTC)Hmm... That sounds bit questionable when one actually writes it down.
Just A tad to Add.. =)
Date: 4/26/11 08:29 pm (UTC)2) I always thought about that line during the end of the book when that one dude was planning on killing Gen during the sword fight..*smirks*
3)Yup, he's married now. Now, when he does stupid things someone's going to worry and thus the need for apologies..(which tend to get very boring ;-))
4) Also, everyone knows she poisoned her first husband, but it was unexpected. So, yes shock. Not to mention they think Gen's an idiot and any one who knows Attolia should know NEVER to drink from her wine cup. ;-) of course, Gen and Irene have a totally different view on the whole matter in which he'd probably die laughing before anything else.
5)I think mwt mentions somewhere (though I can't remember where...) or maybe it was a discussion we had before. But thieves are like bad luck, you stick around them long enough you might somehow get them angry and then next thing you know, you start losing your most valuble belongings!
6)HEHE, yup.
7)I thought about this other day, I always felt like he did give Susa information because it was a moment when Gen was being geniunely himself. However, i think the baron finding out about Gen's homesickness only confirmed the game that Gen's playing, and he thinks that Gen is so very inept. So no harm done!
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 08:30 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 4/26/11 08:34 pm (UTC)Lady Jane, your source for Gen-similes since 2009
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 08:34 pm (UTC)Re: Just A tad to Add.. =)
Date: 4/26/11 08:54 pm (UTC)(1) So to sum up the scope of matters, she's morbidly teasing, flirting, showing affection, goading, and scolding all at the same time! Now there's a girl who can paint her nails while talking on the phone.
(3) As dull as afternoon television with stale bread and tap water.
(4) Gen just thought it was funny. He was surprised, sure... But these two share a morbid sense of humor.
(5) Now I'm getting Dead Man's Gun flashbacks.
(6) *snickers gleefully*
(7) Yeah, I don't think Costis blow any proverbial holes in the Attolian monarchy's fortress of espionage, but the information could be used against Gen under the right circumstances. If he cares enough about Eddiss to pine from his bedroom window, that could be used against him in the future. It's also a sign of weakness the barons really aren't seeing otherwise. Acting like a fop isn't exactly a sign of weakness as much as it is a sign of being an idiot.
no subject
Date: 4/26/11 09:16 pm (UTC)3- Gen is Gen, and will always be silly and evil with his nefarious plots. :P
4- If the Queen poisoned her King, especially so blatently in front of her whole court and Eddisian ambassadors, that'd lead to all out war with Eddis. Attolia, the country (and the queen) doesn't want that.
Hope I'm not repeating what everyone else has already told you! :)
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Date: 4/27/11 12:07 am (UTC)I <3 PARENTHESES (((()))))) ;)
no subject
Date: 4/27/11 01:26 am (UTC)In terms of how Attolia acts towards Gen throughout most of this book (in public, that is), I think we can put it down to a few things. (1) She's got an unemotional mask that's part of how she rules, so it might be hard personally and difficult publicly for her to suddenly break that persona. (2) She's not very good at showing emotion. (3) She needs her barons to support her and they probably won't take her lead in following the king just because they see she loves him. In fact, if they see the king as a fool and they see the queen being affectionate towards him, they will only think the queen is a fool too, and that will erode her power. So (3) I think Gen's acting the fool gives her no choice but to keep her jokes and affection private.
...all this makes me think that might be another layer to her snarking at his behavior. He's put her in a slightly awkward position.
no subject
Date: 4/27/11 12:25 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 4/27/11 09:50 pm (UTC)"The events of the state rolled on. The queen showed every sign of affection for her king, and it was accepted as a necessary artifice."
So here, we know that even when Attolia does show some sincere fondness for Gen, people are not going to take it seriously. They might still respect her and support her, but they would still think that there's no love in between them. If anything, thinking that Gen is an idiot will just make them laugh unkindly behind his back, assuming that Attolia is playing him and winding him around her finger.
no subject
Date: 4/27/11 10:09 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 4/27/11 10:12 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 4/27/11 10:14 pm (UTC)This is a fantastic point. I'd never thought of it but it makes so much sense!
no subject
Date: 4/27/11 10:17 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 5/1/11 02:13 pm (UTC)